Sunday, July 27, 2008

Essential Oils, Update

I have a feeling this is going to be long. My fingers are vibrating.

First things first, I got my essential oils! I ordered three: peppermint, lavender, and citronella. I shall explain!

Peppermint: I have a tendency to get migraines, between my wisdom teeth issues and an old neck injury. They suck, and I really don't want to ever take medicine. I want to DEAL WITH IT and get beyond the pain, not mask it. Peppermint oil is a cooling oil, so it feels awesome on your skin. When I feel a migraine coming on, I rub it on my temples, the back of my neck, and along my jawline; then, I inhale the scent of my hands deeply. You can refresh every fifteen minutes as needed, though I've only needed to refresh once. After applying the oil, I rest and enjoy the cool tingle on my skin. My headaches have always subsided and I am able to carry on with my day. This is a tremendous improvement over being bedridden for 24-48 hours, dependent on pills and muscle relaxers. Peppermint also makes you perky and alert. My daughter loves it hardcore because she thinks she smells like bubble gum.

Lavender: OH MY GOD THIS IS THE BEST STUFF. Seriously. I apply it before hypnosis and my sessions are so much deeper. My neighbor takes care of a fussy baby - I swear this child mellows out and collapses against me as soon as I enter into her house. My husband has given me full body massages with my CFO and a few drops of lavender oil - bliss. Pure bliss. Jeebus. People say it helps with stretch marks and burns, too. WIN!

Citronella - I am making my own buggie spray! No more crappy toxins on my children. :-D

I purchased my oils from Rocky Mountain Oils. They are really reasonable and I got my oils quickly. I highly recommend them if you are considering purchasing essential oils.

Now - on to the kind of negativish thing. :( I had intended to purchase Young Living products, but I did a bit of research on the company and its founder and I was less than impressed. Well - that's actually an understatement. I was pretty much horrified. This was really disappointing because I know a few people who participate in their distributorship program and really enjoy the YL company; also, I wanted to get the Thieves Blend available only through YL. However, I cannot support this company in good conscience. To each their own, but it never sat right with me. Ah well.

Back to the good stuff! I am not sure what I am going to get next, but I am thinking of making a vanity purchase and getting vanilla. I love the warm smell of vanilla, and apart from its obvious benefits, it would make a great perfume to stinkify myself with!

Edit: make sure you get 100% pure, therapeutic grade oil! A lot of what is available at stores is not 100% - far from it. This seriously impedes its effectiveness. Happy smellies!

47 comments:

  1. Sarah,

    Yes, there's all kinds of junk on the internet about Gary Young. But you should look into the background of the authors before allowing them to influence your life.

    For example, Stephen Barrett and his Quackwatch organization has probably been responsible for scarring the most people away from Young Living. But who is Stephen Barrett?

    See what he has to say about anything outside of the mainstream medical system that you take seriously (massage, essential oils, chiropractic, Dr Mercola or any popular "alternative" figure and, yes, raw) and you'll quickly understand that Quack Barrett will create the same type of lies about you if you ever become a threat to the people who pay him to spew his vomit--the pharmaceutical industry.

    Other than that, the biggest detractors to Young Living seem to be those who have a built-in interest of promoting sub-standard oils. Before Young Living came along and created a standard and educated people in the French model of aromatherapy instead of the British model (which was based on perfume-grade oils and became popular in the US because no interpretation was required), there was nobody to hold the feet of producers, middlemen, and retailers to the fire. Of course, they don't like the accountability...thus the vitriol against Gary Young.

    With thousands of acres of farms, several published research papers and bottles of oil which have a Supplement Facts panel printed on the label, Young Living has proved itself over and over again.

    (Young Living has submitted to standards sufficient enough to get FDA approval for internal use. Compare this to the "For Topical Use Only" copout that most oil companies slap on their bottles so they will be held to non-existent cosmetic standards...thus the antifreeze and engine degreaser in OTC shampoos, conditioners and cosmetics.)

    The real question, Sarah, is why are you attracted to people and companies who, at best, don't measure up and, at worst, tear down others in order to make themselves look good?

    Where are the farms of your suppliers. Do they even have a distiller? Do their most basic oils--say lavender and frankincense--have supplement facts or do they say "For Topical Use Only"? Where are the published research papers of the people you are trusting?

    The dozens of MDs, hundreds of DCs, and thousands of LMT, RNs, etc. in Young Living aren't stupid. Young Living didn't become the largest supplier of therapeutic-grade oils based on lies.

    Years ago, Young Living prepared a 21-page rebuttal to Quack Barrett's lies. Young Living hasn't sued Barrett because, to those who have eyes to see, Barrett's ramblings reflect more badly on him than on Young Living. Let me know if you're are interested in seeing this.

    Caleb Eaton
    Young Living distributor since 1997 who just returned from a week of weeding, harvesting, distilling and learning at Young Living's amazing farm in St. Maries, Idaho. (Can you do that with your suppliers?)

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  2. Hey, Caleb! Thank you kindly for your impassioned response. I sincerely appreciate it.

    On Stephen Barret: yes, I did notice he is against raw/vegan lifestyle. He is allowed to his opinion, but I am obviously of a different persuasion. He was not the only article I found, as I did quite a bit of digging around. The internet is filled with opinions, assertions, lies, damn lies, and statistics. It is difficult to ignore a recurring theme, even more so when I am considering putting my hard earned dollars and faith into a product.

    Years ago, Young Living prepared a 21-page rebuttal to Quack Barrett's lies.

    Yes, I would absolutely love to see this. I am wondering why this isn't readily available to the public? To the eye of the casual browser, it seems like Young is ignoring a largely damaging article. If you Google Gary Young, the quackwatch article is the FIRST article available. Ouch. Why wouldn't he want to sue him if it is all truly printed rubbish? He has to understand that it is heavily hurting his business, especially in an age that people are turning more and more to organic answers to their body's problems. If he is truly without blame, I would love to see him address the libel with a strong, firm, and public stance.

    The company that I chose to go with, Rocky Mountain Oils, is an internet-based company. They test their oils to ensure their quality and yes, they can be taken internally with the exception of Birch, Eucalyptus globules and Wintergreen. Their website actually praises Young Living, but offers a less expensive alternative because of no down line payments.

    I do not particularly care for MLM companies and when I was considering joining the distributorship of Young Living, it would have been only for my purchasing purposes. I am very comfortable with Rocky Mountain Oils, and I have been thrilled with my personal experiences with essential oils. I do have 'the eyes to see', and continue to look for the truth at every turn.

    Best of luck to you and your endeavors!

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  3. Why hasn't Young Living and Gary Young done more to defend itself/himself on the Web? I think it boils down to the fact that Gary Young disdains computers and doesn't understand how much "we" depend on them. (You don't get to know a computer like you get to know a plant or an oil...different parts of the brain.) Consequently the staff has been slow to make it a priority. However, there are now some official things in place that will that, over the long term, cause Barrett's article to loose it's #1 ranking.

    I, personally, am working on some things too. Not to deal with Barrett's lies (thus spreading the negative energy), but pointing out all the positive things Gary Young is doing and has done. Gary is too humble to do so himself. When people get to know this man first, Barrett's lies are obvious. For example, Gary has started a clinic in Ecuador where oils are administered through IVs...something that is not allowed in the US. I have not yet been to the clinic, but I know plenty who have. These are stories that need to be told...and will be.

    Some positive stuff about Gary Young on the Web...
    Young Living Milestones
    Gary Young Website
    (Again, a fraction of what could be told.)

    Here's the rebuttal to Barrett's lies about Young Living.


    Why not sue Barrett if it's all rubbish? Again, when you know Gary, you understand. Two reasons off the top of my head: (1) The one thing Gary probably hate worse than computers is lawyers. Lawyers are a coward's way of dealing with issues like this. A much more honorable way is through a jousting challenge which Gary has semi-humorously offered while addressing this subject during meetings. (2) Gary has a deep belief that he's got a greater defender. Whether you call it God, The Universe, Karma, or whatever, Gary knows the Barrett will get what's coming to him. There's no reason for Gary to get in the mud with Barrett. Gary's got higher-frequency things to do...trekking through the jungles of Ecuador discovering new plants (Gary has now named one that previously had no name [Dorado Azul - Blue Gold] - that's in the science books - not arguable, not a bunch of fiction, and he's busy developing curriculum for a university in Ecuador that will be part of the MD (medical doctor) program. All to help people as he was originally doing in a clinic in Mexico where he first considered network marketing because (1) patients and friends and family of patients were clamoring to get the products for themselves, (2) the [quality assured] products were available no where else and (3) a cashier at a health food store simply wasn't going to acquire the education necessary to teach people the difference between WD-40 that smells like lavender vs true therapeutic-grade lavender.

    That brings us to the network marketing aspect of Young Living...
    I don't know anyone that came to Young Living for the money. I sure didn't. But I was practical enough to see that if I was going to buy these products anyway (and I was...they weren't and aren't available anywhere else outside of Young Living), I just as well pay the nominal fee to get the 24% distributor discount from that point on.

    Moreover, since I was ordering every month anyway, why not get additional credits by taking advantage of the Essential Rewards program? When all is said and done, I essentially pay 50% less for my products than the retail price given on the website. Stupid enough to pay high MLM prices? No. I suspect that if you'll use those figures to compare the prices of your supplier you'll realize that I didn't let my hang-ups and biases again MLM trick me into throwing money down the drain of a so-called "discount supplier."

    And, finally, we get to the really good part about Young Living--it shares the wealth. MLM is not inherently good of bad. It's a tool. People have used hammers to kill others. Obviously, that doesn't make hammers bad. In the hands of a company with a heart, MLM is wonderful! For example, I love teaching people about health (at least those ready to take responsibility for themselves). Because of Young Living, I am now able to do so full-time. And teach others how they can have time freedom as well as health freedom.

    But it started out small. Simply telling my family about these wonderful products and how they could get them delivered to their door for the same discount price I did. Before long, my monthly commission check from Young Living was paying for my products. (Huh...while objectivity allowed me to move forward and find a way to get my products for free, you're bias still has you stuck way back there at "MLM products are overpriced.")

    Fast foreword 10 years and you blog about your supplier that will never reward you for so. Meanwhile, I blog about my supplier and they reward me because they consider me a partner--I, and thousands of devoted users like me, are they're marketing and education department. Young Living doesn't have the expense of sales and marketing like your supplier does. Instead, they share that portion with me.

    How much? Well, 50% stays with Young Living to go back into R&D, new farms, quality testing, etc. The other 50% is split among the distributors. So, essentially, there is a 2X markup over the actual product cost. Outrageous!? I certainly don't think so. I have health food stores in my downline. A 2X markup is normal for the non-YL products they have on their shelves. And that's a 2X markup on their cost. Chances are good that there where markups by several middlemen along the way. Since your supplier has no farms of its own, I wonder how many markups happened before you got your hands on the product? And, if you reverse think it, how cheap must the product have been to start with? Low quality? Does your supplier do testing in house to hold its suppliers feet to the fire?

    In the end, you're paying a much higher price than I am (or any of my new distributor signups are) while thinking you're getting a food deal. Boy! Somebody sure did a good sales job on you. And you didn't even know it. And you are marketing for them and don't even get paid for it. Wow! In Barrett terms: What kind of cult are you in?
    :)
    Caleb

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  4. It's good to hear from you again, Caleb. The rebuttal was an excellent read; it is obvious that D. Gary Young has a strong following. I admire your hands on experience in the essential oil field, gathering lavender that makes the oil you sell. I would never think to doubt your commitment to your trade, nor would anyone else that had more than a passing conversation with you.

    As for Rocky Mountain Oils, I am very pleased with them. As I do not intend to engage in selling oils, my level of involvement suits me perfectly. I am a little confused - did you even go to their web page? They offer a less expensive, yet comparable product to Young Living. In addition to doing so, they offer words of praise for Young Living and its commitment to product and education. Are you committed to education as well? I believe you are, and I would think you would be happy to spread the benefits of essential oils. I have enjoyed reading your website and getting little tidbits of information. Would it not give you ease to know that people are embracing therapeutic grade essential oils, regardless of where they are purchased? From Rocky Mountain Oil's website:

    Our mission at Rocky Mountain Oils is to provide exceptional therapeutic grade, essential oils at an affordable price.

    Dedicated to the quality and purity of our product, we purchase our oils from around the world and only accept those meeting strict quality guidelines. All of our oils are tested with Gas Chromatography and Spectrometry or GC/MS testing, which means we test which molecules are present in a sample and check them against a recognized standard. Through this testing, we find any impurities or chemical fertilizers, and discover whether or not the oils have been diluted in any way. We only sell 100% pure, therapeutic grade essential oils.


    The benefits of essential oils are undeniable. I would encourage you to continue to be a shining light in the world of essential oils, and leave behind your negativity of Stephen Barret. It serves to no purpose but to call additional attention to his damaging article. To me, the most damaging part of the article was the following:

    By this time he had divorced Donna and married his second wife, Dixie. In Mexico, Young ran the Rosarita Beach Clinic where he offered treatment of cancer and other serious diseases. He also established a similar clinic in Chula Vista, California. One of his Rosarita Clinic brochures claimed that he offered "the most comprehensive treatment program in alternative medicine." The modalities included chelation, lymphatic massage, acupuncture, color and magnetic therapies, "bioelectrical medicine," homeopathic remedies, and a vegetarian nutrition program . The clinic also offered iridology, live cell analysis, and "blood crystallization," which he claimed could detect degenerative diseases five to eight years before they caused symptoms.

    Later that year, a Los Angeles Times reporter conducted a different sting. After obtaining a test kit by mail, he prepared two slides using blood from an apparently healthy cat that belonged to a Glendale, California veterinarian. After bringing the slides to the clinic, he was told that they showed cancer that had been his system for four or five years. When the reporter suggested that the test be repeated, he used his own blood and was told that the specimen showed signs of "latent cancer" but that problems of the liver, pancreas, and thyroid were present for which "cleansing, detox, and rebuilding" were advisable. A few weeks later, the reporter mailed another blood specimen from a chicken and was told that it showed liver inflammation and "the possibility of a pre-lymphomic condition." Chicken blood cells have no nuclei and look very different from human blood cells under a microscope. But the Rosarita Beach Clinic staff did not appear to notice that the blood was not from a human source . A clinic flier stated that Young had researched the test and, after examining over 10,000 specimens, had proven that the test was "95% accurate in diagnosing early stages of disease development." However, it seems more likely that the clinic found nonexistent major problems and offered expensive treatment to everyone who took the test.

    In October 1987, Gary and Dixie Young announced the kick-off meeting of Young Life International, the "marketing arm" for "Dr. Young's Formulas" used at the Rosarita Beach Clinic. I have seen no further information about the nature or fate of this company.

    In 1988, Young was arrested in California for misleading and deceptive advertising and for selling supposed cures . An undercover agent submitted a sample of her blood with a fictitious male name for the bogus "blood crystallization" test. Young reportedly told her that she had prostate cancer with cells that could act in a "potentially aggressive manner." Other charges against Young included selling unapproved medical devices and unapproved new drugs, manufacturing medical devices and drugs without a license, advertising drugs and devices to cure cancer, and practicing medicine without a license.


    The rebuttal does not address these claims. I, as well as many others, have a certain loathing for snake oil sellers and this damns Young into that category.

    I am not in any type of cult, unless wanting to be an informed consumer can be considered an occult. Should these claims be so bogus as you insist, I do hope that you and yours do everything in your power to bring Barrett's article away from the number one spot on Google. While I respect the Doctor's preference away from computers and lawyers, his teaching spirit should advocate for truth above all and I would imagine he would do everything within his power to see it promoted.

    I will continue to learn and grow while embracing this raw, natural lifestyle. I hope you do the same!

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  5. I'm sorry if I'm coming across as criticizing RMO. I'm primarily challenging your original automatic assumption that YL oils are more expensive because YL is an MLM. And also the assumption that you must sell oils in order to buy YL oils at a distributor discount. I became a YL distributor to get the oils at the best price. So did everyone else I know. You never have to sell if you don't want to. Its just that, as you have found with RMO, some of us can't stop talking about it after we have the experiences.

    RMO Lavandula Augustifolia (Hungary) 15ml - $16
    RMO Lavandula Augustifolia (Bulgaria) 15ml - $20

    YL Lavandula Augustifolia 15ml
    Retail - $27.30
    Wholesale - $20.75
    Equivalent price after I apply my Essential Rewards for ordering other products each month for 12 months - $16.60 (also discounted shipping)

    Questions that you might ask...
    - Does RMO have its own GC or does it depend upon others?
    - What size is the GC?
    - Who calibrated the GC? (In other words, what standard are the oils being tested against? A drug companies GC? AFNOR has certified the GC? Gary Young helped them calibrate the GC?)
    - Who knows how to read it? Is there anyone in the company who can interpret the GC? How did they learn it?

    The answers really don't matter to me. I'm just wondering if you know the questions to ask to really trust this company's oils. And those are just a few questions regarding the GC only. As you can tell, I'm completely satisfied where I'm at. And I've been asking questions for 10 years.

    On one hand you say, "I would encourage you to continue to be a shining light in the world of essential oils, and leave behind your negativity of Stephen Barret." (Which is exactly what YL and Gary Young have chosen to do.) On the other hand you say, "I do hope that you and yours do everything in your power to bring Barrett's article away from the number one spot on Google" while citing some of Barrett's stuff in your blog.

    I just read the article cited by Barrett regarding the cat and dog blood samples. The typical hatchet job done by a press that is scared of anything outside mainstream medicine, especially considering that mainstream medicine buys most of the advertising. Furthermore, it just reinforces the fact that Barrett enjoys stretching the truth to fit his ends -- Gary Young did not even do the samples. Barrett has all kinds of legal action against him for telling yarns (read the link in my original comment and lots of other stuff about Barrett's troubles.

    On the other hand, while this reporter sought to trash a certain type of blood analysis that is not understood in a US medical system enamored with drugs and multi-million-dollar analysis equipment, that method of analysis is a very well respected science in Germany.

    As far as the thing about Gary going to jail...
    Hey, anyone that knows the stories of true health pioneers like Hulda Clark, Raymond Rife, etc. considers this a badge of honor. The mainstream medical system defends its turf well. My own Grandpa went to jail under the similar circumstances. There were also people that suffered greatly for hiding/freeing "slaves" at one point in US history. There are times when helping people trumps the letter of the law and its backwards-thinking enforcers. History will judge Gary Young a hero and Stephen Barrett and clown.

    If you choose to blog about RMO, so be it. RMO is a spec that merits no attention from me. But I hope we have come to the point where your decision to do so is based upon something with more substance than
    - price comparisons with YL based of feelings
    - bias against YL because it is an MLM (the tool)
    - innuendos against YL from proven/paid liars

    You will be a much better apostle for RMO as a result.
    Too bad they're never going to pay you for it. :)

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  6. Hey, Caleb.

    To be clear, I am not attempting to be an apostle for RMO. Do I enjoy their product and service? Absolutely. Do I know the nitty gritties about all the many questions one should ask when considering a purchase of an essential oil? Nope, but I do have a good starter point thanks to your comments and other information gleaned from the internet.

    Let's be honest with each other - you are here because you are fanatical about YL. And why not? You have certainly outlined your reasons in detail. Anyone reading my teeny blog would have your case to examine if they are considering purchasing essential oils and creating a space for their use in daily life.

    Why am I here? I want to learn and I want to grow. If you've read any of my other posts, you would know that I was previously SAD, overweight, and hopeless. I have found a lifestyle that grants me abundance above and beyond my most desperate wishes. It's more than eating raw - so much more. Essential oils are part of that lifestyle for me - they allow me to be free of the burden of over-medication, especially in regards to my migraines. I joke that peppermint oil is my new crack - but I rely on it to have a vibrant day. Do I care if RMO gets more revenue? YL? Not necessarily. I want people to be free, too, and with a basic understanding of quality and usage. Wherever they take their business, I want this same feeling of hope for them. It transcends making money from my down lines or anything of the sort.

    Do you realize how much power your message would deliver if it was devoid of your despise of Stephen Barrett? Do you realize how much power his position on Google alone has? There is a way to address the concerns without being negative and bashing Barrett or accusing people of being in a cult.

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  7. What I'm saying is...
    You've got a platform for the whole world to see. Whether you realize it or not, you're marketing SOMETHING. Good health. Freedom from meds. Eating raw. Going to the grocery store on the way to pick up kids. Whatever. It's like Tom Brokaw or another news anchor claiming s/he is unbiased. Come on! The trustworthy ones are upfront about where they are coming from. You're blogging because you want to tell the world whatever. You're a salesman. A marketer. An apostle. For whatever. With a podium. The difference between you and I is that I'm not ashamed of it.

    And I used your platform (Thank you.) to give you and the world another side to your original post. Remember? You where "horrified" by what you found on the internet about YL. Now, hopefully, you see another view and won't "promote" the negative (false) stuff again on your platform. I just didn't want you and your readers (years from now included) to continue "drinking the Kool-Aid." Get it? Whether or not you meant to, YOU spread "false doctrine" about YL by first buying into the negativity on the internet enough to search for a different oil source and second by mentioning it from your podium.

    The cult reference is a result of you-know-who inferring that distributors for YL are mind-numbed robots following an evil but charismatic Gary Young down the primrose path. And again, by being horrified, you--on some level--bought into the lies of you-know-who. If he makes us sound like a cult, it seems an effective tool demonstrate the folly of those who fall for his lies. Plus, this is writing...aren't metaphors a good thing?

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  8. So sad. No offense, but if they are wrong about one thing, I can’t help but wonder where else they've stretched the truth or obfuscated it in order to refute legitimate criticism.

    In the refutation of Quackwatch's mostly excellent trip down Young's memory lane, they write: “Gary Young received his Doctorate of Naturopathy from Bernadean University. At the time when Gary was working on his degree (1982-85), Bernadean was the only school offering these studies. During this time, the school was under the direction of Joseph M. Kadans, Ph.D. All the coursework that Gary completed was reviewed by a medical doctor. The university, however, did not participate in the accreditation process.”

    A shameful fiction is being promoted here. Bernadean is a diploma mill (google it, or follow this link) which explains why it did not participate in the accreditation process. How could it, diploma mills don’t qualify for ‘participation.’ That’s like someone who doesn’t qualify for membership in a club who then says, “I chose not to participate in the club activities.”

    There was, at that time (1982 to 85), only one naturopathic medical school in the country . It was (and is) a four year naturopathic medical school, requiring three years of pre-medical education to matriculate. Today there are 5 such schools recognized as having degree granting authority by the Department of Education (which has actual criteria for credible education) Of course, there are still plenty of diploma mills around who sell degrees to people too ignorant to know the difference or who intentionally seek to muscle up their resumes with bogus credentials. If Young is as smart as you believe, I can only guess that it’s the latter.

    The issue here isn’t Quackwatch. There are many legitimate criticisms that can be leveled at Quackwatch. But the real issue is Gary Young, and his claim to an education that he did not earn, that he only dialed back his claims about it when people started noticing and calling him out about it.

    If Young Living makes quality products, why inflate the resume of the founder? It’s a legitimate question, and one that any person capable of critical thought will recognize as deserving of an answer.

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  9. Note to future readers...

    1. Dan appears not to have read the link I provided for the rebuttal to Barrett's lies about Young Living.

    2. Dan made his post 18 months after this thread was put to rest.

    3. Dan's Blogger profile link is bogus.

    Is it reasonable to conclude that Dan is a drive-by poster who has an ax to grind that is more important to him than seeking/spreading the truth?

    See how this works, folks? There's a strategy behind it. Create an official-looking site solely for the purpose of trashing the reputations of anyone who dares to take a stand for natural approaches to health, then reference the official-looking site in perpetuity so false negatives are continually spread.

    Want proof that Young Living is real? Visit any of the 4 farms yourself. Then see if you can visit the farms of any other essential oil retailer in the US. There are none. THAT'S reality. Any legitimate questions about essential oil quality should start there. Anything else is a distraction...probably purposefully placed by those with something to gain.

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  10. Just a person browsing the internet looking for my best option for purchasing essential oils. I came upon the RMO site and was also familiar with YL and have been using Forevergreen products (a break-off of YL?). I was looking for reviews about RMO and found this site.

    Sorry Caleb, but you convinced me to go with RMO. You may need to refine your sales tactics

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  11. Everyone has a past.. bla bla bla.. I too am interested in the oils at a reasonable price and RMO seems the way to go for someone who doesn't have the funds to have to buy fifty dollars worth a month to get a cheaper price and is still LESS money than YLO....

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  12. $50/mo not required to get Young Living oils at a discount. You can become a distributor by purchasing a $40 Starter Kit. And stay a distributor by purchasing approx $50 per year.

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  13. Caleb, I wish i could download your brain.

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  15. Caleb, I notice in your Blogger profile you have a link to a site (I'm assuming yours) selling Thieves products. So let's talk about Thieves. YL perpetuates the "four robbers during the plague" myth in regard to the origin and alleged effectiveness of this product. However, nearly every iteration of this robber myth contains eucalyptus in the mix of "aromatics" the robbers were using. One little problem with this: the plague hit France somewhere around the mid-1300's. Eucalyptus is native only to Australia and some islands in the Pacific--it was not known to Europeans until the late 1600's. That's at least a 300-year gap. The Young Living website calls the myth a "historical account" but it doesn't cite where in history this story can be verified. Can you shed some light on the dubious origins of this product?

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  16. Sweat Bee: Here's the exact quote from the YL page you referenced. I've bolded the important words:

    "Thieves® was created based on research about four thieves in France who covered themselves with cloves, rosemary, and other aromatics while robbing plague victims."

    Notice that YL doesn't make claims to be an exact duplicate of the recipe used during the Black Plague. The misunderstanding comes from distributors and customers who recall the story but don't bother with the details. Those can be found here:

    http://www.secretofthieves.com/four-thieves-vinegar.cfm

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  17. Sweat Bee: Here's the exact quote from the YL page you referenced. I've bolded the important words:

    "Thieves® was created based on research about four thieves in France who covered themselves with cloves, rosemary, and other aromatics while robbing plague victims."

    Notice that YL doesn't make claims to be an exact duplicate of the recipe used during the Black Plague. The misunderstanding comes from distributors and customers who recall the story but don't bother with the details. Those can be found here.

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  18. Caleb:

    Here is the statement printed in the YL Theives pamphlet and quoted on many YL distributor websites: "Young Living’s Thieves essential oil blend was created based on the historical account of four thieves in France who protected themselves from the Black Plague with cloves, rosemary, and other aromatics while robbing victims of the killer disease. When captured, they were offered a lighter sentence in exchange for their secret recipe..."

    YL's marketing people don't seem to understand the difference between history and legend.

    Since Theives doesn't contain garlic or vinegar or alcohol which seem to be the major part of the recipes, it doesn't make logical sense to connect the YL product to the myth to begin with. It's just a fun little story for marketing hype.

    Also, I can't find any evidence of a study conducted by "Weaver State." I can find something that was conducted using the facilities at Weber State, but it was not an independent study. It was both sponsored and conducted by Young Living. That's a misleading omission on the part of YL reps.

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  19. Sweet Bee: It still seems to me that "based on" is the pivotal phrase that you prefer to ignore. If you are put off by new reps that lead you to believe it's the exact recipe, find one that is more knowledgeable/trustworthy. In the previous comment, I provided a link to the most detailed info I've seen.

    So the Young Living marketing department chooses to simplify the story by citing one "historical account" rather than getting bogged down in explaining dozens of "historical accounts" that add up to the legend. I call that effective communication. It's only anal people like me (and apparently you) that care to know the fuller story.

    Here's the abstract of the Weaver State Thieves study with a link to purchase the full abstract. I've got a copy of the full abstract, but unfortunately I haven't figured out the copyright and legal ramifications of offering it on the website.

    But if you're not just on a witch-hunt and there is a true interest, perhaps buying the full study will be worth it for you like it was for me.

    Yes, Gary Young helped finance the study...15 years ago. Since then, no pharmaceutical companies have offered to finance a Thieves Oil study. Nor the FDA or NHS. Nor other universities who stand to lose their pharmaceutical funding and government grants if they demonstrate that sometimes natural substances can be more effective than a patented ones. Young Living's competitors haven't offered to fund a Thieves Oil study. And you don't seem to be offering. So I'm not sure what the beef is about Young Living citing the study it was willing to fund. Especially when Gary Young's name is listed there on the study for all to see. And you'd be just as unsatisfied if there were NO study.

    I suspect Weaver State would have sued long ago to get Young Living to cease and desist if it felt like YL was the boogeyman that you apparently feel responsible to protect the world from.

    Some people simply buy the oil...and enjoy it...and buy it again. And again. I suspect that's what really bugs you. Along with the fact that Young Living got the copyright on the Thieves Oil name before the company that you would apparently prefer people buy from.

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  21. I was thisclose to signing up with Young Living. Caleb has convinced me otherwise and I just placed an order with RMO.

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  22. To Caleb: I love that you have passionately defended a company/founder/product that you believe in, and that you have supplied an enormous amount of information which proves that you’ve done your research, you’re informed, and you are worthy of being heard. Like Sarah, I too ran across the article by Barrett, and was somewhat taken aback. However, I have learned that most things should be taken with a grain of salt, and I continued to look for additional information. You've supplied reliable sources, in depth articles from non-parties, and references which evidence the claims made by Young Living. I found this to be very informative. Furthermore, I must add, if someone actually ran straight to an alternate company to buy oils, in the middle of "researching" products, just because they didn't like your response on this blog...well, I guess I can only hope that they stick with the research next time, and aren't thrown from their quest for knowledge by a stranger's temperament. It's unfortunate that all research, to improve their personal health, ceased the moment that they didn't approve of your comments, but sometimes you can only make your best effort, and then let it be what it is. I just want to close by mentioning that the debate began by the blogger attacking Gary Young, and I can clearly see that you only defended what was attacked in the first place. I fail to see why anyone would argue that your comments would be better received if you "didn't attack" Barrett; and in the same breath argue that Young Living SHOULD attack Barrett in order to be better received. I don’t claim to know everything about Mr. Young, but I do know that it is not my place to judge anyone, that I’ve read what you’ve supplied and I’m happy and comfortable with Young Living. When anyone ever offers anything good, whether it conflicts with modern medicine or not, they will be attacked. If you stop working for the good, and spend your effort, time and energy on debating your truth with someone that will NEVER change their mind about you, will never support you, and will never care to listen or correct themselves (let’s face it, that article would continue to exist forever, whether or not Mr. Young sued) you’ve handed your challenger the win. All they sought to do, with their attempts to hurt you, is to cause you to stop your work. I don’t believe that giving your challenger what they want is the answer. I believe in letting your work do the talking. I hope people will be open minded enough to read all they can find, including all the articles you've provided, and then they'll be able to form a complete opinion. I would just try to encourage people to be available and willing to learn more. It's so unfortunate to see an opinion formed based upon an article which is absolutely not inclusive of all of the facts. Thanks to everyone who participated in this feed, as it definitely helped me immensely in my quest for more information! P.S. When you referenced the reason for your defending Mr. Young (that years from now others would run across the attack, and could be swayed by it) you were absolutely correct! It's been approximately six years since you took to the blogosphere to defend your beliefs- and had you not done so, you'd be able to count me among the unformed swayed by the article. Thank you, so sincerely!

    Shauna

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  23. Whoa! That was a lot to try to take in. I'm usually not one to comment, but I had to about this. I'll be the first to admit I know the bear minimum about EO's. I just like the smells and am looking for a more natural approach. I'm sure my first few rounds of EO's were toxic sludge, but I had no idea how complex it was to find a good product. The more I read, the more confused I become. Personally, I just wanted to find out where to purchase the best oils for diffusing in my home and mixing into skin care products. After all my reading on the internet, I might have been better off using my "wing it" approach.

    I am sure the blogger and the YL rep could care less about my comment… But, I just wanted to say that it kind of sucks how polluted the internet can be. Everyone has an opinion and is very willing to share it. Americans are bombarded every single day with advertising about products that are destroying our health in the name of the almighty dollar. Now it seems that more alternative or holistic options have given up on the idea of improved health for the sake of the dollar. I guess where there is money to be made, the health of people goes out the window?

    This comment is not toward the blogger or the YL guy!! The comment is written at my disgust for how darn complicated and competitive it seems to be to find a bottle of oil to diffuse! I understand it is much deeper than that, but how does the average Joe find out how to buy a decent quality EO to use to help "clean" up her life? All the articles, blogs, sales pitches about quality, purity, testing, marketing make it so confusing to understand if I found a good company or if I should just go back to buying perfume and Febreeze?! I do believe the natural health community is on the right track (for what its worth) and I am all with the blogger, can't we all just share the love of EO? And those who know how to help peons like me… maybe just use layman's terms to help point us in the direction of health instead of poison?

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  24. Wow. I think there is room in the world for more than ONE essentials oil company. Not every one has to worship at the altar of YL. Not that I have anything in particular against them, I don't believe that they are the end all. I have them, I also have doTerra, but I also placed an order for RM. I do believe they have a quality product at better prices. It doesn't make sense that MLM's don't charge more for products. They do have commissions to pay out. It only makes mathematical sense. Also, I have come across a couple studies, on line, about different companies that were tested for purity and let's just say that out of the companies that were tested (YL and doTerra among them), RM and one other co (I can't remember now) were the only ones that passed as completely pure. I think all the oils mentioned by me are good. However, I don't worship ne over the other and don't think people should be "told" what to think. People have the right to have thei own opinions.

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  25. Mr. Young probably IS wiser and more knowledgeable now than when he 1st began his medical journey but still it is decisions such as this that have me wary of not only him but his associates as well and whatever he is currently touting: "...The two doctors he employed are Roger Belden Lewis, M.D., a board certified
    family physician, and Sherman Johnson, M.D., a pediatrician who is not board certified. I wrote to
    Dr. Lewis asking about the training and credentials of the clinic staff, but he never replied.
    The Utah Division of Professional Licensing (DOPL) web page shows that Johnson has a
    disciplinary record. A DOPL representative told me by telephone that Johnson’s license was
    suspended from 1994 to 1999 for felony medical misconduct related to the misprescribing of
    narcotics. With that record, he would probably be unable to be credentialed to practice at a hospital
    or to participate as a provider with medical insurance plans.
    Two archived articles in the Salt Lake City Tribune provide more details [16,17]. These reports
    state that Johnson was married for 28 years but also had a girlfriend named Donna Jones for 14
    years. Jones was mentally ill with multiple personality disorder, and Johnson acted as her doctor
    even though (a) pediatricians normally don’t treat adults or people with serious mental problems,
    and (b) romantic involvement with a patient is considered unwise and unprofessional and, in many
    states, is grounds for disciplinary action.
    Jones apparently believed that she had cancer. She didn’t, but she shaved her head and toted an
    oxygen tank to look the part. And she became addicted to narcotics prescribed by Johnson for her
    nonexistent cancer pain. In fact, in the final six months of her life Johnson prescribed 386,000
    milligrams of Demerol, an enormous dose. Eventually Johnson injected her with a lethal overdose
    of Demerol and she died in his arms. He falsified the death certificate and she was buried. Later, a
    nurse raised suspicions. The body was exhumed, the overdose confirmed, and no evidence of
    cancer found. Asked why he never ordered any tests or work up for cancer, Johnson said that
    tests were unnecessary because his friend wouldn’t lie to him. She had told him that the cancer
    was injected into her body by “a coven of gay witches and doctors”.
    Johnson avoided a homicide trial by pleading guilty to manslaughter. In a presentencing hearing,
    the district attorney recommended a sentence of 1 to 15 years in the state penitentiary. Instead,
    the judge sentenced him to a mere 90 days in the county jail. was also fined $12,500."

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  27. Why is this newspaper article never referenced? Why are people saying the statement about "D. Gary Young delivering his child under water and a coroner stating that the child probably would have lived" is completely false when apparently it was said, and printed by someone in a newspaper- somewhere with actual events with actual people? It apparently happened. And is not completely a lie. Something was said and something was reported when this happened. So now, is the rebuttal of Young Living a fake since it did not accurately state facts?If Quakwatch is accused of being a lie, now isn't whoever wrote the rebuttal which was not addressed by Gary young, Will gary young even answer your questions about this if asked? https://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1314&dat=19830309&id=6dkvAAAAIBAJ&sjid=qe4DAAAAIBAJ&pg=1542,3826078&hl=en

    This happened and it sounds like what people have stated happened to the owner of Young Living, Gary Young.

    Not a hater. Check the blog.

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  28. https://cloud.real.com/s/dABUUR

    ?? PLease debunk this caleb. Would like truth.

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  29. http://www.sultanyusufsalah.com/


    Apologies to "the raw deal" for my links replies.

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  30. Another news paper article about it. https://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1314&dat=19830310&id=6tkvAAAAIBAJ&sjid=qe4DAAAAIBAJ&pg=7124,4646687&hl=en

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  31. For new viewers: Please note that this thread should have been put to bed years ago. Nobody should care. But who might take the time occasionally to find every possible ancient thread that mentions Young Living or Gary Young and use the opportunity to, yet again, plant doubt in people's minds?

    Answer: Haters paid by another oil company that is jealous of YL's success. Especially if that other company is making a new marketing push disguised as a neutral "oil summit" hoping to get more business by hanging on the coattails of YL. In other words, the other company is hoping you will consider any other company EXCEPT YL.

    Believe me...all these apparently fresh "nasty" things are discussed in great detail among YL distributors in private groups where trolls (who have no interest at getting to the truth) aren't allowed to waste everyone's time. YL distributors don't have their heads in the sand. In fact, they are often aware of these things before anyone else...sometimes decades earlier.

    Child drowning: The reason this story can no longer be found on Quackwatch is because it was as embarrassingly biased and full of half-truths as much of other information on that site and they probably didn't want to loose hundreds of thousands more dollars in court for slander.

    Truth: Gary's own words.

    Practicing without a license: Anyone who is truly serious about alternative health and understands the history of the AMA and FDA and their role in handicapping any serious alternative to petrochemical-based medicine readily understands that the words from the newspaper clipping came straight out of one of those bureaucratic organizations. The article's purpose, again, was not about getting at the truth, but about embarrassing the "mark" so badly that he would never be heard from again. Was Gary claiming to be a medical doctor or was he simply helping people find health after medical doctors sent them home to die? Two very different things. But neither the article nor the AMA/FDA make such distinctions.

    Sultan Yusuf deal: YL's official response is right there for all to see. But I'm suspicious that this guy would go through this much trouble himself. Could one of those hater oil companies really be behind this? Why is this domain—the one pretending to be Yusuf's—be registered and hosted at US companies rather than an African ones? And why would the owner of the domain have paid for that information to remain secret?

    I will add this as an example of the things Gary is accomplishing while the hater oil companies nip at his heals.

    For readers who are SERIOUS about doing true research on oil companies, begin with the one subject the hater companies want to distract you from: FARMS. Start at this page and the links at the bottom.

    ReplyDelete
  32. Dig deep enough into "Frickable" (the commentator that provoked my response) and it appears s/he has dabbled with YL. My premise remains...that this is a profile created as an elaborate ruse. But in the off chance that Frickable is indeed curious...

    Frickable, your upline is a much better resource about YL than a Google search through info presented by skeptics. Go high enough and you'll find someone who has visited the farms, perhaps worked on them, has met Gary, and who can connect you to private groups that are more capable of answering your questions. Go even higher and you'll find people who knew Gary 20 years ago when he was still hand-labeling bottles. They can tell you of the exclusive oils that Gary brought to market after years of research that were later copied by other companies. They can tell you about the plant that was not in the biology textbooks until Gary named it. There is tons of exciting stuff to learn. And you never will if your sources are skeptics.

    ReplyDelete
  33. Caleb Eaton said...
    For new viewers: Please note that this thread should have been put to bed years ago. Nobody should care. But who might take the time occasionally to find every possible ancient thread that mentions Young Living or Gary Young and use the opportunity to, yet again, plant doubt in people's minds?
    Frickable Says- Caleb, Oh my goodness I am so very sorry, I did not realize there are rules about posting questions or concerns after a certain date. Or that after a period of time you cannot post. Please send the link to the rules where that is stated, Thank you.
    I find your statements a bit contradictory. In your first paragraph you make it sound as though the only people who would research Gary Youngs or Young Livings “ancient” mentions, are “HATERS” people who are trying to plant DOUBT in peoples minds. … Oh reading further… haters who get paid.. YOWCH I could be getting paid for asking these questions? Or being concerned and researching this company and founder? I think I am getting ripped off, hey How would I sign up for that?
    Now Caleb, This paragraph below…. is a little… I do not know.. you sound like someone who believes that young Living is the only company out there, the only ones who speaks truth about their oils, the only ones with pure oils. The only company who could possibly make a pure essential oil. The only company with a ‘Doctor’ standing behind it… or wait what? (sorry that was just a snide slip in no basis comment)
    What rank are you in Young Living? Be honest now. Star? Diamond? …. You sound like my upline. (Which I will address that below)

    Continued next post

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  34. Caleb Eaton said...Answer: Haters paid by another oil company that is jealous of YL's success. Especially if that other company is making a new marketing push disguised as a neutral "oil summit" hoping to get more business by hanging on the coattails of YL. In other words, the other company is hoping you will consider any other company EXCEPT YL.
    Frickable Says- You sound like there is no other company besides YL. How is that any different? You believe Young Living is to the bone HONEST all the way through. A company who does not air their mistakes in truth, address it and move on, is what? A company founder who will answer your questions on record… wait he does not do that. Or did I miss this? Has Gary young addressed his past and present and future? Honestly? Where are the faults? We are humans, they exist.

    Caleb Eaton said...Believe me...all these apparently fresh "nasty" things are discussed in great detail among YL distributors in private groups where trolls (who have no interest at getting to the truth) aren't allowed to waste everyone's time. YL distributors don't have their heads in the sand. In fact, they are often aware of these things before anyone else...sometimes decades earlier.
    Frickable Says- I would like to see you group… or join in those discussions, because those type of discussion are banned from my uplines groups. Oil Rush, Oily Wisdom to name a few.. those are my direct upline’s groups. Because I do not Praise Gary’s name, and believe Young Living is the only truthful, oil company, I am accused of several things. So because i do not sound like them I am a hater? Because I might think that them stating they are the ONLY honest company in essential oils I am a hater? Because I do not BLINDLY believe? Because I am not taking my uplines word for it? I took my uplines word that Gary Young was a Doctor. I then went on to tell others he is a doctor, who cured himself from a paralyzing accident, yet there is no proof of this. He is not even a Doctor?! Oh yeah go get the PFP injection, GAry is a Doctor it worked for him, he has a clinic in Utah, go try it… WHAT?! Did I tell my friend to do…. based on what? The false advertisement of Young Livings founder. I even watched a DVD… and was told he was a Doctor this great man everyone revered in other countries. Sorry but when i got my head out of the sand and started researching what UPLINES and other REPS are saying… even what Gary has claimed about himself… I have questions and concerns thanks. AND my research only started on APRIL 7th 2015 because of a shady oil that I used as directed, advertised as an autism oil but caused a whole lot of eye opening.
    Continued in next post
    #2

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  35. group rules (SOME)
    ATTENTION ALL MEMBERS!!!
    Oily Wisdom is continuing to grow quickly and with that comes some much needed changes.
    Here are our NEW group rules:
    1. All posts will need admin approval. It may take up to 12 hours for your post to show up in the feed as mods are available to approve posts.
    2. We will not be approving the following posts:
    rash photos, posts that start with “HELP!” or “Emergency!”, posts asking for a diagnosis or prescription, posts that have the word "treat" in them, asking for a "treatment", negative or complaining posts (talk to your upline privately please), or most posts regarding other oil companies. If it's a very common question, please use the search tool.
    CHOOSE YOUR WORDING WISELY/LEGALLY----You CAN ask things like "does anyone have a personal testimony for ____?” or “What have you used and liked for _____?” but posts like "help! my son has an asthma attack, what do I do?" will not be approved.
    If your post was not approved, it probably fell into this category.
    4.Testimonies—Please post your testimonies- we would love to hear them! We want this group to be based on research and your testimonies.
    5.Negative or complaining posts: Please contact YL customer service or your upline/Sponsor. Those 2 avenues should get your problem solved. We are here to help you but would like to keep negativity off of the group page. This is a place for positivity, support, and encouragement.

    Frickable says- I contact my upline… my concerns are not addressed only by one person. There is NO discussion about Gary, there is no discussion about anything deemed negative and questioning Gary is negative. Questioning Young Livings is negative. Questioning or having concerns is negative in these groups. I have noticed.
    Caleb Eaton said...Child drowning: The reason this story can no longer be found on Quackwatch is because it was as embarrassingly biased and full of half-truths as much of other information on that site and they probably didn't want to loose hundreds of thousands more dollars in court for slander.
    Frickable says- Its not only Quack watch who discusses this or brings it up. The point was, the “Hater debunkers” the people who write all the stuff trying to prove young Living is an honest company (although never Gary young or the company themselves I do not think) just some friends or doctor friends of Gary, post “debunking the debunking” whatever it was called, quacking the quacker, anyways. The people who write it, some are claiming the arrests or events never happened… The ones in the newspaper that I posted previous. Why claim it never happened when it did happen at some point. that is what I do not understand.

    Continued in next post
    #3

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  36. Caleb Eaton said...Truth: Gary's own words.
    Frickable says- Caleb, I had my baby in the wild. It was careless, … Yeah… I am grateful Gary is actually discussing something real from his past… but there are always 2 sides to 1 story. I would have naturally believed what he said if I hadn’t experienced my eye opening event on April 7th… So now, I am going to need proof. Did his wife really not see a doctor? Were they in a hot tub or not because Gary does not mention that.
    Caleb Eaton said...Practicing without a license: Anyone who is truly serious about alternative health and understands the history of the AMA and FDA and their role in handicapping any serious alternative to petrochemical-based medicine readily understands that the words from the newspaper clipping came straight out of one of those bureaucratic organizations. The article's purpose, again, was not about getting at the truth, but about embarrassing the "mark" so badly that he would never be heard from again. Was Gary claiming to be a medical doctor or was he simply helping people find health after medical doctors sent them home to die? Two very different things. But neither the article nor the AMA/FDA make such distinctions.
    Frickable says- Nor does Gary Young make any distinctions, or talk about it. Was he in Mexico using the banned drug, claiming to be a Doctor, and What kind of a Doctor. Did undercovers really deliver him Cat blood to test at his “medical center” Did the cat have cancer for real or did the patient? Gary had I think 3 clinics...or at least 3 incidents with clinics in papers.
    http://articles.latimes.com/1987-10-23/news/mn-10747_1_blood-analysis
    Caleb Eaton said...Sultan Yusuf deal: YL's official response is right there for all to see. But I'm suspicious that this guy would go through this much trouble himself. Could one of those hater oil companies really be behind this? Why is this domain—the one pretending to be Yusuf's—be registered and hosted at US companies rather than an African ones? And why would the owner of the domain have paid for that information to remain secret?
    Frickable says- Why would you host a website in Africa? trying to reach americans? Is that a crime? I did not know you had to be from the U.S to video blog your experiences and or send stop and desist orders. I am really not sure how the African, american domains come in to play with whatever the argument is here. Which is what? Caleb making claims about a company and a man…with other people… without substantial proof? At this point, Who knows what is true between Yusuf and Young Living, no one was there. Both people can be shady and lying. What is the proof that either one of them are stating truth? All I can go off of is how many stories do not match up to truth? Its called research. Finding the facts and finding the false and weighing it all. Asking questions. Even if it means you will find people who call you a hater or view you as a hater…. such as caleb and my some of my upline and other reps.
    I am sorry if my questions and or concerns and researching articles- that prove something did happen when other state it never happened, bothers you. I am sorry that I cannot just believe a company telling me they are the best when there are documents proving- that they too, have had faults, and less than pure oils being sold on the market. Young Living is not perfect. But claiming to be and not admitting to any faults is much of a problem and make people think cult. Or vaccine company.
    continued in next post
    #4

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  37. Caleb Eaton said...I will add this as an example of the things Gary is accomplishing while the hater oil companies nip at his heals.

    May 5, 2015 at 9:43 P
    Caleb Eaton said...For readers who are SERIOUS about doing true research on oil companies, begin with the one subject the hater companies want to distract you from: FARMS. Start at this page and the links at the bottom.
    Frickable Says- I am a bit insulted with the insinuation that I was not serious when I devoted a whole bunch of my time trying to prove that Gary Young was an honest person and found out there is a whole bunch of proof that he is not. I kinda debunked myself. I had doubts and went out to prove those doubts had no business being in my mind. I proved my doubts accurate. Sorry that it is an inconvenience for you. I am not comfortable advertising a company by lying about it. Honestly I had been excited about YL… and now it is a crashed bus. Explosion of information… all because I wanted answers about Rutavala oil and having a toxic plant RUE in it, possible reactions and information about whether or not an article was true.
    Caleb Eaton said...Dig deep enough into "Frickable" (the commentator that provoked my response) and it appears s/he has dabbled with YL. My premise remains...that this is a profile created as an elaborate ruse. But in the off chance that Frickable is indeed curious...
    Frickable says- YES dig real deep into the “Frickable” commentator…. real deep...deeper… there are so many ways to go with this… humm mature way or immature way.. that is the question. Well let me just say that I am a Doctor working for an essential oil company here to defame all others… Wait isn’t that what gary young is doing… Well he was successful at it. Seriously as i make this remark, it is true? Gary young and Young Living are also stating that NO other company is pure- like them, no other company is honest or has integrity or has as much time put into the research of essential oils as Young Living does. That is what they are doing to other companies. Degrading others for their gain, to keep you buying from only them. How is that any better than what you accuse of the so called haters of trying to do?
    Caleb Eaton said...Frickable, your upline is a much better resource about YL than a Google search through info presented by skeptics. Go high enough and you'll find someone who has visited the farms, perhaps worked on them, has met Gary, and who can connect you to private groups that are more capable of answering your questions. Go even higher and you'll find people who knew Gary 20 years ago when he was still hand-labeling bottles. They can tell you of the exclusive oils that Gary brought to market after years of research that were later copied by other companies. They can tell you about the plant that was not in the biology textbooks until Gary named it. There is tons of exciting stuff to learn. And you never will if your sources are skeptics.
    Continued in next post #5

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  38. Frickable says- I find it hard to believe that everyone has been a skeptic? The people who wrote about the arrests just reporting it? The people who are reporting all these things, Sure I can definitely see where the quack guy was a hater, but every single person who has anything negative to report or say about Gary is in the wrong? Is a skeptic? Every article out there not saying what you want it to say is wrong? They are haters? Who is the real hater? Every other company is bad and is not authentic because Young Living says so? Where is Young Livings batch testing to authenticate? Do they batch test? Will they send a certificate?
    I think people cause a bigger issue when they are closed minded and have a way of thinking that if you do not agree with them, they are haters. There is no possibility that Gary was ever shady or a liar in his past that even suggesting this makes me a hater. It looks worse on the company and does make the ‘cult’ accusations come to life. I never seen it as one until researching further and constantly being accused of something for even questioning what was in an oil.
    I have talked to upline members, I have tried to get answers from people in YL but I am not interested in the crap that has NO credentials behind it. No proof. No nothing they all talk out of their butts. Especially after finding out I was told Gary is a doctor and then to find out he has NOTHING close to supporting this. Again some things could be rested if he produced that certificate with credit hours served and such, but he doesn’t.
    I find it hard to believe that every single person is “out to get him”. That is cult talk. Crazytown talk. There are ton of actual Natural Paths who are not persecuted. Plenty of people selling unconventional health products that do not fit mainstream thinkers, who are not being persecuted. So is there a legitimate reason for the questioning, persecution etc?
    I did not start really digging into anything about Young Living and Gary until April 7th 2015. When NO ONE could answer me about Rutavala. No one could answer if an article was true regarding a jumpsuit comment from an employee of YL…. No one was there dealing with the issues. No When i was asking for information or if this incident had happened to anyone else, I was assumed or accused of being a YL hater. You want to know who did actually respond to me?
    Dr. Pappas’s Essential Oil University responded.
    Tom | Health-Essentials.info responded by email.
    FDA responded by email and sent a phone number.
    Besides all of this- I still have made my order of 100.00 on products that might not be what they claim to be. Who knows. I will be more picky and choosy about which oils I buy from Young Living. I like the thieves cleaner. I like thieves oil. I will buy frank from somewhere else. I will not be closed minded to other companies and I definitely will not help spread the BS about Gary being a doctor and so of course he would make sure his oils are pure. I will not do that anymore. I will not take any persons motto or saying or statement about anyone without further looking into it. I will not follow blindly. Again my issues are with cover ups, people claiming to debunk the debunking and claiming Gary’s arrests never happened but clearly they happened at some point, to someone, also posted in a news article at some point in his life. Do I care… not about the arrests only about the lies that everyone makes in attempt to pretend they do not exist. Etc.
    I am done wasting time with YL I know what I know, have learned what i needed to know and can move on and try other companies if I want to. Shared my findings with some friends who wanted to show up and corrected my original incorrect knowledge relayed to me by upline… about Gary and his doctorhood, and how unquestionably honest and great his company is.
    Continued in next post
    #6

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  39. Frickable says- I find it hard to believe that everyone has been a skeptic? The people who wrote about the arrests just reporting it? The people who are reporting all these things, Sure I can definitely see where the quack guy was a hater, but every single person who has anything negative to report or say about Gary is in the wrong? Is a skeptic? Every article out there not saying what you want it to say is wrong? They are haters? Who is the real hater? Every other company is bad and is not authentic because Young Living says so? Where is Young Livings batch testing to authenticate? Do they batch test? Will they send a certificate?
    I think people cause a bigger issue when they are closed minded and have a way of thinking that if you do not agree with them, they are haters. There is no possibility that Gary was ever shady or a liar in his past that even suggesting this makes me a hater. It looks worse on the company and does make the ‘cult’ accusations come to life. I never seen it as one until researching further and constantly being accused of something for even questioning what was in an oil.
    I have talked to upline members, I have tried to get answers from people in YL but I am not interested in the crap that has NO credentials behind it. No proof. No nothing they all talk out of their butts. Especially after finding out I was told Gary is a doctor and then to find out he has NOTHING close to supporting this. Again some things could be rested if he produced that certificate with credit hours served and such, but he doesn’t.
    I find it hard to believe that every single person is “out to get him”. That is cult talk. Crazytown talk. There are ton of actual Natural Paths who are not persecuted. Plenty of people selling unconventional health products that do not fit mainstream thinkers, who are not being persecuted. So is there a legitimate reason for the questioning, persecution etc?
    I did not start really digging into anything about Young Living and Gary until April 7th 2015. When NO ONE could answer me about Rutavala. No one could answer if an article was true regarding a jumpsuit comment from an employee of YL…. No one was there dealing with the issues. No When i was asking for information or if this incident had happened to anyone else, I was assumed or accused of being a YL hater. You want to know who did actually respond to me?
    Dr. Pappas’s Essential Oil University responded.
    Tom | Health-Essentials.info responded by email.
    FDA responded by email and sent a phone number.
    Besides all of this- I still have made my order of 100.00 on products that might not be what they claim to be. Who knows. I will be more picky and choosy about which oils I buy from Young Living. I like the thieves cleaner. I like thieves oil. I will buy frank from somewhere else. I will not be closed minded to other companies and I definitely will not help spread the BS about Gary being a doctor and so of course he would make sure his oils are pure. I will not do that anymore. I will not take any persons motto or saying or statement about anyone without further looking into it. I will not follow blindly. Again my issues are with cover ups, people claiming to debunk the debunking and claiming Gary’s arrests never happened but clearly they happened at some point, to someone, also posted in a news article at some point in his life. Do I care… not about the arrests only about the lies that everyone makes in attempt to pretend they do not exist. Etc.
    I am done wasting time with YL I know what I know, have learned what i needed to know and can move on and try other companies if I want to. Shared my findings with some friends who wanted to show up and corrected my original incorrect knowledge relayed to me by upline… about Gary and his doctorhood, and how unquestionably honest and great his company is.
    Continued in next post
    #6

    ReplyDelete
  40. I am posting this very unorganized bit of information below, I am not going to clean it up, it is most of the links or sources for why I have decided to question Young Living. Not hate them, just not blindly follow or refer people as I had before...uneducated about everything, I will research more thoroughly about anything YL has to say and what their followers say. These statements do not represent me in anyway or what i believe to be true or not. This is just research information I gathered.
    http://www.utahstories.com/2014/08/damning-evidence-that-young-living-and-doterras-essential-oils-are-adulterated/

    Video of Somalian dude
    http://www.sultanyusufsalah.com/

    http://archive-org-2013.com/org/q/2013-10-21_3059444_69/A-Critical-Look-at-Gary-Young-Young-Living-Essential-Oils-and-Raindrop-Therapy/
    quackwatch report also backed up by these links to NEWSPAPERS with dates and names

    https://news.google.com/newspapers?id=6tkvAAAAIBAJ&sjid=qe4DAAAAIBAJ&pg=7124%2C4646687

    This is an article defending Gary Young and most links in here argue this persons opinion.
    http://www.younglivingconnection.com/lib/pdf/Debunking_The_Debunkers_of_YLEO.pdf
    https://news.google.com/newspapers?id=6dkvAAAAIBAJ&sjid=qe4DAAAAIBAJ&pg=1542%2C3826078

    defending young living
    http://www.essentialoilsage.com/wp-content/uploads/pdf/barrett-gary-young-rebuttel.pdf
    defending
    http://www.mynewearthjourney.com/quackwatch-rebuttal-page-2.html
    http://www.degreeinfo.com/general-distance-learning-discussions/5945-bernadean-university-now-burney-university.html
    http://bernadeanuniversity.tripod.com/
    gary's nd http://www.amazon.com/Aromatherapy-Essential-N-D-Gary-Young/dp/0964818701/ref=asap_bc?ie=UTF8

    http://www.utahstories.com/2014/08/report-used-in-young-living-farms-case-against-doterra-suspect/

    http://www.jonnsaromatherapy.com/pdf/Briggs_Real_Story_of_Gary_Young_2013.pdf

    http://www.utahstories.com/2014/08/report-used-in-young-living-farms-case-against-doterra-suspect/

    http://www.utahstories.com/2012/07/the-loss-of-utahs-green-belt/

    https://www.facebook.com/notes/alice-sanvito-lbt/what-you-should-know-about-young-living-oils/738326349584622

    continued next post

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  41. https://www.facebook.com/notes/alice-sanvito-lbt/what-you-should-know-about-young-living-oils/738326349584622
    What You Should Know About Young Living Oils
    September 16, 2014 at 3:18pm
    I began writing this article with the intention of adding a second part focusing on Gary Young's personal history. Because the subject has come up again in a massage therapy forum, I'm posting this article now. It may be revised later.

    Many massage therapists enjoy using essential oils in their massage oil and as a result of this, I became exposed to the world of aromatherapy and essential oils early in my career. I enjoyed using some essential oils myself for a number of years until I developed an unfortunate sensitivity to many of them. I found the fragrance of natural lavendar and other essential oils to be quite pleasant and enjoyed mixing them for the pure enjoyment they brought. Along the way, I learned that one needs to observe caution with some EOs, as they are often called. Most need to be diluted with a carrier oil or they will burn the skin. Some can cause photosensitivity. Many may be toxic if ingested. I learned that contamination, adulteration, and fraud is rampant in the EO industry. I remember one year when the lavender crop failed in France. The price of lavender oil skyrocketed. Meanwhile, a European agency charged with testing EOs found that not a single batch they tested remained unadulterated. In spite of claims of the purity of their oil, apparently every producer tested had succumbed to adulterating their lavender oil with synthetic lavender that year. More recently, an aromatherapist noted that three times more tea tree oil is sold than is actually produced. Armed with this information, I took all manufacturer’s claims of purity with a grain of salt.

    Additionally, I found many claims of aromatherapists to be . . . well, dubious. Based more on tradition than actual evidence, every essential oil had a list of conditions and ailments for which it was supposed to be a remedy. Lime oil was good for post-menopausal women; clary sage was said to be good for high blood pressure. The list was endless. However, I found there was little to no evidence to support any of these claims outside of a very, very few. Eucalyptus oil, for instance, was said to be good for coughs and, indeed, I’ve found its vapors to be soothing during mild asthma or for mild coughs. However, claims that clove oil would protect one from influenza or that bergamot would boost the liver and spleen seemed far-fetched and without any evidence. Still, if one set these claims aside and just enjoyed them for fragrance, I saw no harm in it.

    continued next post

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  42. continued from previous
    Still, that YLO is an MLM is not, in and of itself, alarming. It should, however, be noted, so that the unwary person invited to a presentation is prepared for their very slick sales pitches.

    What are more troubling are the unfounded, often ridiculous, claims, false information, and hazardous practices that YLO promotes. Let’stake a look at just a few of them.

    False claims

    YLO literature is so full of false claims that it is hard toknow where to start. Take the claim that essential oils can be used to cure scoliosis.

    http://www.younglivingoils.com/scoliosis04.htm

    This claim is completely unfounded and unsupported, yet this claim is made on their website and repeated by their many sales reps. Their article on scoliosis is so full of misinformation it is hard to find a sentence in it that actually makes sense. YLO also claims that one can cure cancer with their essential oils.

    http://youngliving.biz/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/YL-Essential-Oil-Cancer-Protocol.pdf

    In fact, one young woman insisted to me that she had been cured of skin cancer by using YLO essential oils. When pressed for details, she admitted that, in fact, she had received medical treatment for her skin cancer, but still insisted it was the YLO essential oils that had actually cured her. This irrational thinking is unfortunately typical of YLO enthusiasts who get their information from YLO sales literature. Another claim is that their “Thieves Blend” is based on a blend of essential oils allegedly used by four thieves in France who rubbed themselves with this blend to protect themselveswhile robbing the dead during the plague. Absolutely no evidence is provided to support either the veracity of this supposed legend nor the efficacy of it, yet their website claims that diffusing this blend will eliminate airborne bacteria and ingesting it will boost your immune system.

    http://www.youngliving.com/en_US/products/essential-oils/blends/thieves-essential-oil

    Young Living Oils claims, without any supporting evidence, that their blends of essential oils can be used to lose weight,

    http://www.youngliving.com/en_US/products/essential-oils/blends/slique-essence]

    to “enhance the frequency of harmonic balance around us,”

    http://www.youngliving.com/en_US/products/essential-oils/blends/abundance-essential-oil

    to “support normal, healthy emotions during women’smenstrual cycles,”

    http://www.youngliving.com/en_US/products/essential-oils/blends/dragon-time-essential-oil

    to sharpen your sense of smell,
    http://www.youngliving.com/en_US/products/essential-oils/singles/basil-essential-oil

    to “enhance the ability to release hurtful memories and movebeyond emotional barriers,”

    http://www.youngliving.com/en_US/products/essential-oils/blends/forgiveness-essential-oil

    to “support the liver and digestive and lymphatic systems”and “healthy cell function,”

    http://www.youngliving.com/en_US/products/essential-oils/blends/juvaflex-essential-oil

    to “enhance the body’s aura,”

    http://www.youngliving.com/en_US/products/essential-oils/blends/white-angelica-essential-oil

    to “support normal glandular function,”

    http://www.youngliving.com/en_US/products/essential-oils/blends/sclaressence-essential-oil

    ReplyDelete
  43. continued from previous not my wording or beliefs just research
    False claims

    YLO literature is so full of false claims that it is hard toknow where to start. Take the claim that essential oils can be used to cure scoliosis.

    http://www.younglivingoils.com/scoliosis04.htm

    This claim is completely unfounded and unsupported, yet this claim is made on their website and repeated by their many sales reps. Their article on scoliosis is so full of misinformation it is hard to find a sentence in it that actually makes sense. YLO also claims that one can cure cancer with their essential oils.

    http://youngliving.biz/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/YL-Essential-Oil-Cancer-Protocol.pdf

    In fact, one young woman insisted to me that she had been cured of skin cancer by using YLO essential oils. When pressed for details, she admitted that, in fact, she had received medical treatment for her skin cancer, but still insisted it was the YLO essential oils that had actually cured her. This irrational thinking is unfortunately typical of YLO enthusiasts who get their information from YLO sales literature. Another claim is that their “Thieves Blend” is based on a blend of essential oils allegedly used by four thieves in France who rubbed themselves with this blend to protect themselveswhile robbing the dead during the plague. Absolutely no evidence is provided to support either the veracity of this supposed legend nor the efficacy of it, yet their website claims that diffusing this blend will eliminate airborne bacteria and ingesting it will boost your immune system.

    http://www.youngliving.com/en_US/products/essential-oils/blends/thieves-essential-oil

    Young Living Oils claims, without any supporting evidence, that their blends of essential oils can be used to lose weight,

    http://www.youngliving.com/en_US/products/essential-oils/blends/slique-essence]

    to “enhance the frequency of harmonic balance around us,”

    http://www.youngliving.com/en_US/products/essential-oils/blends/abundance-essential-oil

    to “support normal, healthy emotions during women’smenstrual cycles,”

    http://www.youngliving.com/en_US/products/essential-oils/blends/dragon-time-essential-oil

    to sharpen your sense of smell,
    http://www.youngliving.com/en_US/products/essential-oils/singles/basil-essential-oil

    to “enhance the ability to release hurtful memories and movebeyond emotional barriers,”

    http://www.youngliving.com/en_US/products/essential-oils/blends/forgiveness-essential-oil

    to “support the liver and digestive and lymphatic systems”and “healthy cell function,”

    http://www.youngliving.com/en_US/products/essential-oils/blends/juvaflex-essential-oil

    to “enhance the body’s aura,”

    http://www.youngliving.com/en_US/products/essential-oils/blends/white-angelica-essential-oil

    to “support normal glandular function,”

    http://www.youngliving.com/en_US/products/essential-oils/blends/sclaressence-essential-oil

    and to “support the endocrine system.”

    http://www.youngliving.com/en_US/products/essential-oils/blends/endoflex-essential-oil

    In fact, it’s hard to find something these essential oils won’t do.

    Is there any evidence to support any of these claims? Who needs evidence when there is money to be made?

    These are but a few of the implausible claims made by Young Living Oils and this is just in regards to their essential oils. They sell other products with just as unfounded and ludicrous claims. Dr. Eva Briggs, who heard Gary Young speak at the Total Health Expo in Toronto in 2004, described the founder as a “total wacko” telling “whoppers that topped anything Mark Twain might have created." This article deserves attention for describing many lies and false claims that Young made about his “research” and his products.

    http://www.healthwatcher.net/quackerywatch/Young-Oils/totalhealth2004.html

    ReplyDelete
  44. continued from previous not my words or beliefs just research)

    Deceptive wording

    YLO is fond of using the term “therapeutic grade” when describing their essential oils. However, this is a term made up by YLO themselves. There is no standard for what the term “therapeutic grade” means.


    Raindrop Therapy: A tangled web of lies, false claims, and hazardous practice

    One of the most touted of YLO’s “therapies” is “Raindrop Technique.” (RDT)

    Gary Young claims to have learned this technique in 1973 from a Lakota elder named Wallace Black Elk. However, the granddaughter of Wallace Black Elk has written to YLO and to others who perpetuated this story and has said that these claims are false. She denied that Gary Young was trained by Wallace Black Elk and noted that essential oils were not used by the Lakota in any capacity in 1973. Wallace Black Elk’s grand daughter writes, “Our Lakota Medicine Men and Women and their ways are Sacred and all too often bastardized by ‘wanna-bees’. There is no ‘raindrop’, it was completely fabricated by Don Gary Young.”

    She has asked that these claims be removed from websites and literature.

    http://www.naturesgift.com/Lakota-medicine.htm

    http://www.younglivingworld.com/MainFrame.asp?BodyFrame=business/garyyoung_main.asp

    Raindrop Technique applies YLOs proprietary blend of undiluted essential oils directly to the skin.

    http://www.younglivingworld.com/MainFrame.asp?BodyFrame=resources/raindrop_main.asp

    YLO claims that by using this technique, muscles will relax, vertebrae will realign, and scoliosis can be cured. It further asserts, without evidence, that scoliosis is caused by bacteria and that by applying essential oils to the skin over the spine, the bacteria are killed and the scoliosis iscured.

    http://www.younglivingoils.com/scoliosis04.htm

    The National Association of Holistic Aromatherapists haveissued a white paper warning of the hazards of Raindrop Therapy.

    http://www.alliance-aromatherapists.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/White-Paper-on-RDT.pdf

    They state that it puts people at risk of skin irritation byapplying essential oils undiluted to the skin, a practice not supported by the majority of aromatherapists, and they further state that there is no evidence to support the claims made about RDT. The white paper on RDT supports its position with references to research and toxicity regarding some of the essential oils used. Other associations of aromatherapists have spoken out against Young Living Oil’s practices of applying undiluted EOs to the skin and to ingesting EOs. As they point out, these practices are promoted by sales reps who have no training outside of that given to them by YLO. Responsible aromatherapists are appalled and some have suffered repercussions because of irresponsible practices and claims made by YLO.

    ReplyDelete
  45. continued and final (not my claims or words, just research and snippets of research)
    ~Finally done thank goodness. Not even all of it.~
    As if all these unfounded claims, made-up “histories,” and hazardous practices weren’t enough, there’s the story of the founder, Gary Young, himself. When one sees what a mess his life has been, fraught with endless lies, fraud, negligence, and violence, it’s easy to see why his company might reflect the unethical practices of this deranged man.

    Since this article is already long enough, I’ll save the story of Gary Young, founder and owner of YoungLiving Oils, for a separate article.


    Added information:

    An article, written by a nurse, on the practice of ingesting essential oils:
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19125379

    I'd love to have access to the full text of this:
    "Aromatherapy facts and fictions: a scientific analysis of olfactory effects on mood, physiology, and behavior."
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19125379

    Article on essential oils causing seizures in children with links to case reports:
    http://naturopathicpediatrics.com/2014/09/08/essential-oil-safety-danger-essential-oils-seizures-children/
    Note: 9/24/14 The FDA has issued a warning to Young Living Oils and DoTerra regarding claims made about using their essential oils to treat conditions, including ebola virus.

    http://www.fda.gov/ICECI/EnforcementActions/WarningLetters/2014/ucm416023.htm
    continued next post
    continued next post














    Sorry if it offends or was annoying just thought I would post what i found as it most likely would annoy Caleb so I had too.... after all you think I am a hater and think Frickable ...is less then real. Or getting paid by companies which I am not but would so like to be! I do not know what I am suppose to be saying. Maybe it could claim I am a doctor who healed myself. Oops that was already done. Just teasing... being snide or cocky... showing humor from a real person.

    Anyways yeahhh done with this topic.... Now caleb, this should have been put to rest, do not go back on your logic now.

    ReplyDelete
  46. Wow, this was pretty fascinating. I was only looking for a review of RMO. I purchased the Premium Starter Kit from YL as it was the "best" deal for all the oils I got, plus the diffuser. Would I buy it again? Probably not, as RMO are nearly identical to YL. This statement is based on my own experience using both YL and RMO lavender oils on myself and my children (properly diluted). I enjoy using RMO because of their FREE shipping, and more reliable/efficient shipping carrier (DHL). Their customer service is also beyond fantastic and returning a product is the easiest I've encountered in ALL of my online shopping experiences. In addition, they are extremely knowledgeable about oils, and are very quick to respond to email inquiries. On the other hand, YL has the work customer service experience and is one of the primary reasons I will not purchase from them again. Also, their base shipping price is $6.99, and their customer service reps falsely claim that they are being charged this exact rate from the carrier to ship it to me. Why YL would lie? IDK. It's silly really, because almost all companies charge higher shipping rates to cover expenses. Any quick search will tell you that FedEx SmartPost (which takes almost the full 10 business days to get to me) is not $6.99. On the flip side, there are some oils that YL offers that only they offer such as Valor. I have not been able to find a comparable oil to this one from RMO or Mountain Rose Herbs, or any other reputable 100% Therapeutic Grade Oil supplier.

    Here is another interesting tidbit that I find fascinating that all YL reps are so excited to share with me. You can visit the farms where the essential oil plants are grown. I'm sorry but this is just . . . ugh. The farms where the EO plants are grown should be grown in their native land. As I've come to understand (and anyone is welcome to correct me) the YL company has taken some of the seeds from some of the plants and is now growing them in the U.S. instead of where they naturally grow. I guess it really doesn't matter too much to me anyway, since I trust the the produce in my grocery store and I can't see the farms where they grow the produce. LOL

    Lastly, I find it fascinating that very few people pointed out that due to simple math it is impossible for YL to sell their products at a reasonable price when they have to pay commissions to so many people and still make money to continue to make and sell their EO.

    I really hope that other EO users, both new and experience alike, will find this blog post and read the comments. It has been fascinating and a very enlightening part of my evening. I am even more convinced now to not give into the hype of MLM company such as YL and doTerra for EO, and do my research to find the best products for me and my family.

    ReplyDelete
  47. Hi there,

    I have used both YL and RMO and for the money and the quality I prefer the Rocky Mountain Oils. I don't care for MLM's and the greed it promotes to "sell" the product to friends, relatives or whoever. After much research I will stick with Rocky Mountain Oils! (Also, no shipping costs!)

    ReplyDelete